question about berserk special

[Tycho]

Forces don't need a 'strong shield', on a FOnewearl Deband and Jellen are enough, using Resta Merge shouldn't be a problem. Noone has to play well, but if you do want to, acknowledge that allowing Berserk abuse is the 'fastest way for Forces to kill', as Kefka put it. If you chose a male FO and don't want to use a Resta Merge so you can be a more reliable support, that's the problem. In an optimal situation, even, say, Axel's FOmar would not be able to do enough damage to outdamage allowing all the other people to spam Berserk. It may not always be like that, but if you do have to do all the work for yourself when you're using a FO, you can still get new people to play with or something. XP

[Hrith]

Whiteninja, your post shows how you have no experience of the game online, there's barely any use in replying to you.

I have played over 7000 hours of this game online, I know it more than you, get over it.

A Force without a Resta Merge is a very bad thing, a Force using a Merge other than Resta is the stupid one. Enemy resistances online are a lot higher, I have a Lv 191 FOnewearl with max MST, Psycho Wand and all Merges in the game. In Ruins, I cannot outdamage a Lv 130 HUnewearl not using Berserk/Spirit/Charge.
Take the damage you do offline, and divide it by 4 or 5 to get the damage you'd deal online.

Melee FOs are a bit better on the damage dealing side, but online, monsters have higher stats, and the most important against melee Forces: EVP.
Melee FOs need a lot more ATA online, not to mention that their damage is also drastically lowered due to monsters' upped DFP and HP.
At best, a good melee Force can deal half the damage of an average HU/RA, at best.

The Resta Merge is not a required item for a FO. If you don't want to play with FOs who don't use one, then fine. Maybe they wouldn't want to play with you either.

Like I already said, everyone is perfectly entitled to their right to suck at the game.

Of course... I saw that little "(...)" phrase coming from a mile away.

I was being sarcastic, in reference to me using Berserk a lot.
Cool down, sir, a heated debate does not mean we must discard humour.


Netty, you are a hypocrite. You are the only one spitefully putting people into classes.
PSO has a variety of players: skilled players, good players, average players, bad players, newcomers, n00bs, cheaters. The last two being about 80% of the online population.

Want a universal definition of n00b?
n00b: i want heavn punsher
Me: this weapon sucks, you should try getting a better, less rare one.
n00b: y u say it sucks?
Me: it has really average stats, and a very crappy special attack.
n00b: u r so rong lol
Here it is (actual log, with spelling and all).

What does not make a person a n00b, i.e. an undesirable player, is the ability to follow directions, and the aspiration to become better.
The best way to improve your skill is to listen to what more knowledgeable players say to you, and apply it to your playing style.
Do you think I became a "master" by saying to people like Rena, VulpesMundi, Auracom, Ryna, Midori, VioletSkye, Sounomi, etc. "no u r rong lol i no bettar"?

There are still some aspects of PSO where other players are better than me (ep2 c-mode, if you want an example), if a seasoned ep2 c-mode player sees me do something he deems wrong, and suggests "Kef, you should do it that way, it's better", I'm not gonna argue, I'll just do it, because he knows better, so his advice is good.

A level means exactly one thing: how much exp you have. This is only directly related to how many enemies you kill (and dying in the case of BB)... not how you kill them

That is also a hypocritical statement. A high level also means that you have experience (not the experience points, huh? >_>).
I know Lv 150 players that are better than Lv 190+
And I know people with several Lv 200 that suck at PSO.
I was not setting a rule, I was talking about me, I have a very vast experience of this game, besides the technical knowledge.

Whether or not a FO should wear a Resta boosting piece of equipment and heal the party is not subject to opinions, it is the Force's role and purpose. The vast majority of Forces, melee or tech-caster, only do damage cancel when not supporting, that is not an opinion either.

If a person dies using Berserk when they made a mistake, like the ones I cited above, it's their fault. If a person dies using Berserk while a FO is right beside them, it is the FO's fault. Not a hard concept.
Bearing in mind the FO should always try to be in the middle of the team; a Force is the backbone of the party, even geographically, if I may say so.

Yes, a lot is expected from Forces, it's the most complicated class to play, but being a good FO is not hard, a lot of people do it naturally, without even reading my posts, or needing my directions.

Here is one last example to conclude this post. I was playing with a FOmar named Raamori, yesterday. We were attempting 6-4, a timed quest in Spaceship. He was doing Jellen, then Zalure on all monsters, which is the right thing to do. Then I said "since this is a timed quest, may I suggest using Zalure first?", he only replied "ok, sure", and started using Zalure, then Jellen, and we did kill faster, and successfully beat that annoying quest.
Summary: I gave a good advice, thanks to my experience, he followed it, and it made him a more useful Force, at least for that quest.

[NetNomad]

Whoa, too much to quote there... *tries anyway*

Like I already said, everyone is perfectly entitled to their right to suck at the game.

See this is what irritates me (and several others, I'd guess)... you take any strategy that takes away from playing perfectly and call it "sucking." The way you say things like "FOs kill faster by healing berserkers" just seems to say "the faster you kill things the better, and if you don't kill as fast as you can, grats, you suck." Just because a player doesn't do the perfection/time-attack strategy doesn't mean they suck.

PSO has a variety of players: skilled players, good players, average players, bad players, newcomers, n00bs, cheaters. The last two being about 80% of the online population.

Want a universal definition of n00b?
n00b: i want heavn punsher
Me: this weapon sucks, you should try getting a better, less rare one.
n00b: y u say it sucks?
Me: it has really average stats, and a very crappy special attack.
n00b: u r so rong lol
Here it is (actual log, with spelling and all).

Heck yeah, I'd agree with you there and I've seen a few of them on GC too. I can't tell you how many people I've had to tell "just read the damn dropcharts" when I see them carrying around that hacked Double Cannon and they have no clue how rare it is (and consider themselves legit). I DON'T think they comprise 80% of the population, however... at least on GC... and if they do on BB, well that's the main reason I avoid brand-new MMO games anyway: the sheer n00b count is frightening.

Where do I consider myself? I dunno... somewhere between average and good I guess. I'll admit FOs are not my specialty, as I learned 90% of PSO gameplay on a RA. It's just irritating to me how quickly you will use the term "sucky player" when applied to anyone out of the "skilled player" group.

Whether or not a FO should wear a Resta boosting piece of equipment and heal the party is not subject to opinions, it is the Force's role and purpose. The vast majority of Forces, melee or tech-caster, only do damage cancel when not supporting, that is not an opinion either.

FOs SHOULD heal the party, yes... and the second line here is a definite fact, yes... it's just that Resta Merge statement that's really opinion. On a male FO, how much good does a Resta Merge do? In an open area, 2x resta range really isn't that useful anyway. Either way you are going to need to watch your HP or else cluster around the FO when he heals.

If a person dies using Berserk when they made a mistake, like the ones I cited above, it's their fault. If a person dies using Berserk while a FO is right beside them, it is the FO's fault. Not a hard concept.

Well, most of what I have a problem with is covered in your "n00bs" section... the kind of people who barely even look at their HP bar because they expect the FO to be on them 24/7. You need to at least be aware of what's around you and be ready to dodge and yes, heal, as a backup plan if nothing else. Also berserking is just plain overkill in many places, and in those places I try to use my reduced-fluid strategy. But yep, I've seen people go berserking in forest... HUcasts whipping out those hit% vises and mowing down everything while expecting the FO to heal them, when they could just as easily grab a Demo Comet and kill anything without acting like selfish idiots. Then they complain if/when you stop playing into their BS, they die, and then yell at you (in all caps and bad spelling) that you're being a bad FO for not helping them rush through the level like it was their last day on Earth. That's what I'm talking about.

[Forge]

I feel that the major issue here in the nuke/support debate is that we have too few classes in PSO to have a viable answer. In D&D based systems, you have the Cleric and the Wizard. Clerics heal and support, whilst Wizards are the parties Ace up the Sleeve (with such incredible spells as Power Word Kill...). In PSO, Forces are able to be both Clerics and Wizards, which leads to many differences in opinions and expectations.

My answer? Talk to each other before playing, so you know if your Force is a Cleric or a Wizard.

(Bored? Then make the ultimate Cleric - with a non Force! Try either a RAmarl or a HUneweal for both S/D and J/Z, along with a decent MST and Lv20 techs. Plus, both can have eye patches! Pirate Clerics! Wow. I know what my next character will be...)

[Hrith]

But you forget to think as a team, Netty.
It is cool not to always play "perfectly", but you cannot prioritise yourself, not ever. As a team, the team is what comes before all else.
If you cannot think as a team, play solo.

You must also remember that I am only refering to hard areas.

And I do mean GC, when I say 80% are cheaters or dupe-users, on BB it's a lot less -- although too much.

[NetNomad]

And when exactly was the last time you played GC? Of the few people are left on the ST servers, most of them are not idiots... the US ships are mostly cleaned out now, to the point where there's really no "hacker block" anymore. And that's not counting a place we aren't allowed to discuss here... basically, the GC community now is not the GC community of six months ago.

Of course I do team playing... if I did not, I wouldn't cast S/D/J/Z and resta at all... I'd probably only case D/J and resta on myself like I do when soloing with my FOnewm. I've said several times now, supporting is my first priority. I've met literally horrible support forces... the issue here is raeally what is an "acceptable" support FO with regards to berserking. And usually I'm pretty lenient on berserkers anyway because I rarely come across an idiot berserker...

[whiteninja]

I was being sarcastic, in reference to me using Berserk a lot.
Cool down, sir, a heated debate does not mean we must discard humour.

Oh I thought you were actually being serious there. My bad.

I don't know alot about playing in groups, if you can really count my knowledge as any at all even, but I think I know somethings atleast. I was also looking at the resistances of enemies in online/offline, and those would only cut the tech damage in half, not by a fourth or fifth. And when Rafoie does over 500 damage offline, 250 is still damned good.

Here's a solution to the support FO problem: Everyone play as FO's! Everyone! That way no one ever has to worry about being far from a FO because everyone is one! It's brilliant!

[Sebastian]

well i read one qoute of kefkas becuz i dont feel like reading all this typing. and it was about someone dieing w/berserk and its fo's fault or something. but i dont think thats true. that sounds like "OMG i died but i dont wanna be called a noob so im going to blame it on that fo over there not being perfect trieng as hard as they can to meet my inhuman expectations and let me die!"

-.-;; it makes me wonder who people would blame it on if the whole team was cast/caseals lol.

[whiteninja]

Then they'd blame it on the guy with the FO-iest name. "wat?! wtf?! y dont u hav star atmizerz?!"

Yeah, please read the whole thing before posting though... It sounds kind of dumb when you come in here saying "I read part, but I'm to lazy to read all of it." Especially when something may have already been said justifying what you read.

[ShadowNinja X7]

Lol, whiteninja, that would be interesting, if everyone just played as FO's. Lol, imagine if 4 "perfect" Fo's played together. Everybody just casting S/D/J/Z and Resta with nobody attacking. That'd be pretty funny to watch for a few minutes.