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Wow, this has really turned ebil! Here's some interesting facts though i think need to be covered to resolve a few mini-debates also going on here from what ive seen after scanning through recent posts (Apart from the very latest ones, i cant be arsed to read it all lol!).

Every games company currently makes a loss on their home console. Microsoft were losing money on the Xbox when it first came out (Think how much theyre losing now!), PS2 also makes huge losses, and Gamecube makes losses, pretty big now because of the price it stands at at the moment! The PSP & DS arent money losers RIGHT now - At their full retail price they dont lose money for the creator, but instead break-even. Sony can only make money on the PSP through sales of the accessories (The main reason why the games still need memory cards, and big memory cards (Expensive at that) to hold a fair amount of mp3's, film footage, etc to show off the PSPs full list of features). theyre kinda losing out with this Value Pack stuff for that reason, but if they dont package it like that, no-ones gonna buy it unless they've come into a little fortune recently! Companies make their money on games and accessories not consoles. Sony have gone for graphical power where as Nintendo have gone for gameplay.[/fact] In my eyes, i absolutely love the way you play games on Nintendo DS because its so much different to everything else you've known to play computer games so far - However you cant overlook the beauty of the PSPs games, i just dont like how they play. Everyone who has come into the store and seen the PSP demo unit we've got always go straight for the D-Pad. "No mate, theres an analog stick there" "Oh i thought that was a microphone or something" << EVERYONE HAS SAID THAT! lol

Also, multiplayer is a lot better on DS then PSP, especially loading times (Another thing i hate PlayStation for, taking forever, come on, i wanna play!!). If you wanna play a game using one copy of it, on DS its download, its simple... on PSP, its swap the disc, loading, then swap it back, loading, then swap it back again - Come ON!! :/

Nintendo DS' online system also appeals to me, but thats just because we've been waiting to play Ninty games online for so long, and itll be free! I dunno how the PSP internet system works although ive heard there is/will be one...

[Fact time again] Also, the average age of a Pokemon player is around 40 - Pokemon is not a kids game, and its a phenomenomenomenom that everyone loves - Just thought i'd throw that in incase Pokemon gets brought up in this arguement over why the DS is such a kiddy machine

Im surprised that there maybe a PGR on PSP, but then again i guess its not all that surprising since PGR is such a pretty game. Then again Rareware have just started a Nintendo DS development crew, so i guess Microsoft has no say in the handheld war and just see's it as an extra money making opportunity since they cant enter it (Could you imagine how heavy a portable Xbox would be? lol) Microsoft actually seem to be supporting Ninty's handheld a hell of a lot more which is kinda surprising - I remember reading an interview where a rep of Microsoft said they would be supporting the Nintendo DS because its an interesting development system. What next eh? An XBoy? :S

Also i cant believe how many people ive heard say they defo wanna play MGA on PSP after loving the MGS series on consoles... yet the same people who've played both Episodes I & II and Episode III: C.A.R.D. Revolution, absolutely dissed Episode III to hell and back - ITS THE SAME THING DAM YOU!

Ah well, there's my 10 cents worth - Oh and btw, its good to see theres someone else out there who doesnt like GTA and the idea of yet another game. Whats wrong with black people on bikes though? lol

Just because you think it's doesn't make it so and yes pokemon is a kids game if you don't think so then you should finish off your collection of wishing trolls. The pokemon games are targeted at 9-12 year olds the puzzles and the game play are just boring and easy. More people are buying PSPs then DS and DS has been out longer so what does that tell you PSP is better no matter waht you say the fact remains that PSP is better and until DS sells more units then a PSP then and only then will DS be better. So what it loads I don't remeber anyone complaining about PS1 load times? UMDs are alot bigger then a DS game it needs the load time god forbid you wait 15 seconds. O and one more thing the creater on PSO rather make games for PSP instead of the DS.

Yeah, Pokemon is a kid game. Those 40 year-olds who play it have also never been laid.

And as for Project Gothem on PSP, its a no brainer, since PSP has obviously better graphics (For example of this, compare DS's Ridge Racer to PSP's Ridge Racer.) Another piece of info I thought I'd point out, DS is targeted at children who like to play with eachother, so its going to be multi-player kid games, such as Bomberman. Nothing wrong with Bomberman- In fact I love laughing at the look on my friend's face when I kill him from all 4 directions with a chain reaction. Back to what I was going to point out. DS is a kid handheld, yet the cartridges... They are around the size of the PSP's mem card. You know how easily kids are gonna lose those? That's one way Nintendo will make money- kids replacing lost games.

Finally, someone else has the kind of info I'd expect someone who plays PSO to have- Helios, you are the only person here who has acknowledged the fact that Sonic Team will be using PSP.

AS for the more people buying whatever... Yes, worldwide, PSP has sold somewhere around half a million more units at launch than DS did. Also, I know 1 person with a DS, and he's 9 years old. I know around 15 people with PSPs.

And for why I don't like black people on bikes... I just don't trust them. You ever watch someone play San Andreas? Black people on bikes can be scary.

Valero Wrote:Finally, someone else has the kind of info I'd expect someone who plays PSO to have- Helios, you are the only person here who has acknowledged the fact that Sonic Team will be using PSP.

So all you people who look forward to seeing a PSO game on any Nintendo sytem in the future keep dreaming.

Bah i cant be bothered reading all this mumbo jumbo XD

Its all just opinion anywho

So far this year the Nintendo DS has sold almost 200,000 more then PSP in Japan and currently sells by twice as much per week.

Also - No - Seriously it's a fact. The average age of a Pokemon player IS someone in their 40's - And that means even old people (OAPs here!) play the dam game. It sells that way because its such an in depth game and requires a lot of thinking aswell as strategy and tactical thinking. You just here about a lot more kids playing the game then old people, obviously! lol

Lee-yoshi Wrote:Every games company currently makes a loss on their home console. Microsoft were losing money on the Xbox when it first came out (Think how much theyre losing now!), PS2 also makes huge losses, and Gamecube makes losses, pretty big now because of the price it stands at at the moment

I'm not sure on the current position of the market in terms of profit margins and the like but this is an interesting read on how the current market is in relation to consoles and how some of the conceptions people might be slightly off.
http://www.buzzcut.com/article.php?story...3122342247


On the subject of this whole thing, it's all opinion on which handheld is better.

Sony's PSP seems to be the must own thing of 2005. It looks sleek and stylish but it's rather soulless. It is a conservative handheld which will sell well without doing anything amazing.

The DS doesn't look as fancy in both looks or graphical power however it makes up for it with charisma.

The movie and music playing abilities of the PSP are gimmicks. I'm not going to buy an UMD over a DVD be it full priced or even a half priced UMD. Even if it was bundled I'd probably not make use of it as I like to truly enjoy my movie experience. As for MP3s I can buy a good quality MP3 player for a fraction of the price with a greater capacity. So it comes back towards gaming.

Nintendo have made a console that really is trying to move gaming forward. If I give someone, who's not necessarily a gamer, Ridge Racer and a PSP they comment on how nice it looks before going back to whatever they were doing. I give the same person a DS with Wario Ware and they're hooked blowing a car out of harms way, frantically unrolling a roll of toilet paper before the timer ends or slicing a pizza in half.

I'm not sure what it is but given the chance I find that people are more likely to pick up the DS and Wario Ware than the PSP and Spiderman or Ridge Racer.

The PSP will undoubtably sell well and probably overtake the NCL handhelds as the most popular but I don't think it does so on merit. My main hope is Sony go on to evolve the machine to try and cater for different types of experiences rather than giving me PS2 games that I can already play.

Well that's my two pence worth.

Yoshi, you made that number up. DS did outsell in Japan, but it was by a fractional number hardly worth mentioning (try a 4 digit number, maybe 5). And again, the majority of players in Japa are Nintendo junkies. Also, the launch of the PSP didn't do much because Sony sets higher launch prices. Here, the price of the DS is the same of the PSP because the launch is over.

Also, I'm very certain that there are 40-year-olds out there playing- Heck I might have been wrong. Maybe there are more people living in their parents' basements than kids, who knows. Pokemon is an overated game that hasn't been good since Blue and Red. The new ones just have more monsters to complicate A KID'S GAME. I don't care if more adults play it than kids, it is targeted at kids. Blue and Red were the only ones worth money (And maybe Yellow, since you could get almost every pokemon in it).

And Nataku, I've said it hundreds of times- Even if they are the same PS2 games, even if they are the same DVDs, it is now portable. Would you buy a PS2 if it was made into a portable? DVD? Then why not a PSP? Sure, you have to buy the new games, which is bad for people with big libraries. But oh well, PSP has the potential for so many things. You can put movies on the mem cards and watch them. For an internet pirate like me, that's the best thing since Australia. You can supposedly do the same with games- download an emulator and a rom and put it on a PSP. You wanted Nintendo games? Well, there ya go. Emulate them onto the PSP. ^^

With that info about FREE Nintendo games, the only people who would want a DS are those who want it just to have it like me (I said I'm buying it anyway), those who like the unique style, those who have an empty hope for 1st person shooters, or just diehard fanboys and girls.

O I just learned some thing! You can run emulators on a PSP so it's realy dumb that you are buying DS games when you can play them for free just have to download them. So since roms are like a Mega Byte at the most you can load them on to a PSP and Boom you get DS games on a PSP sux to be you who actualy bought a DS.

O neat I hit 100.

Helios Wrote:O I just learned some thing! You can run emulators on a PSP so it's realy dumb that you are buying DS games when you can play them for free just have to download them. So since roms are like a Mega Byte at the most you can load them on to a PSP and Boom you get DS games on a PSP sux to be you who actualy bought a DS.

O neat I hit 100.

How would it work on one screen and without a touch screen or a mic?